So, What's Your Plan?

[The Great Mazinga]

witht the subtitle (what steps are you planning on to make it better)<P>Guess, the topic was too explosive for the board to handle, it was this post that caused the BB system to freak <P>Anyway, back to my original intention.....<P>For me personally, I have been reading many "rants" on the death of culture, music, art, society ad hoc....but the follow up and obvious question has not been forthcoming....seems like many find the arts to be in a state of decay....but what are you prepared to do to correct it?<P>Sounds kinda confrontational, but actually not, I just rather turn the energy into a positive and state what we are doing for ourselves and arts to help the situation...does not have to be Herculean tasks, but just everyday stuff...you may give someone inspiration.<P>(musical interlude)<P> "Hey, don't make it bad <BR> take a sad song and make it better <BR> Remember to let her under your skin <BR> Then you can begin to make it better"<P><BR>Stop contemplating and get active.<P>In this day and age were negativism has become chic and sexy and confused with wit, this might not appeal to some, but it is productive....I bet there are more positives out there amongst us all.<P>"For well you know that it's a fool <BR> who plays it cool <BR> By making his world a little colder" <P><p>[This message has been edited by The Great Mazinga (edited 03-13-2001).]

[The Great Mazinga]

Since I started this...I will go first...I like to take time and volunteer at my local library when they have periodic art appreciation classes....I like to play classical music in the background and the kids really seem to take to it. We do not get very complex or sophisticated, but at least it is about exposure...<P>anyone else involved in some movements that the common person can get involved in...might spur some people on and I am always looking for new avenues personally.<P>

[serge urtizberea]

If I may be so forward, I'm going to say that there is no real reason to get all upset/angry/depressed about popular culture. At all.<P>Pop culture/music/art will never be entirely the vice and evil influence it is being described as so long as it doesn't pervade every aspect of our lives. You can still find 101 different ways to avoid pop culture. Turn the TV off or get specialty cable. Don't go to the movies. Go to the theater, the symphony, the book reading. Skip the entertainment magazines, sell the season tickets, and buy some literary fiction. If your friends are such solely because of your common pop interests, then you really don't have friends (sorry). You can be chummy with people who don't or won't listen to c.m.; just share some character-building interests: physical activity, reading, art, cars, etc... If you try, you can make the best of both worlds and reconcile the angst.<P>The reason I say this is because I've learned the long (but not hard) way. I enjoy popular culture myself to certain degrees. I love The Simpsons and will never stop watching that show so long as I have eyes in my sockets. I like Britney Spears' music (yes, I do) because a lot of it sounds symphonic to me. I like analyzing all those reality-tv shows and seeing mindless popcorn-blockbuster movies every now and then. I'm a sucker for Tommy Hilfiger and Calvin Klein, and I am quite content letting my life be led by brand names and designer labels. Nevertheless, you are VERY unlikely to find someone described like me who will vociferously defend Beethoven to the very bitter end against anyone's disparaging comments and wants nothing more to get a $6000 dual-sub car audio to pump out my Beethoven, Schumann, Liszt, Saint-Saens, Dvorak, and Berlioz at every trendy intersection in downtown Toronto. If you can get past the emotions and understand the whys and hows of popular culture, I think our turmoiled teens here will become a lot more tolerant and perhaps even considerate. Or maybe that's just the passive Canadian inside me speaking.

[The Great Mazinga]

I agree with alot of that serge....your vision is limited to were you focus.....and I believe that we tend to idolize the past. there was a lot of lewd, baudy and cheesy things going on at the time of Beethoven. We just have been filtered through the ages. The perceived cultural tragedies well be forgotten in the long run.<P>I just wanted to get some positive motion on that topic....<P>someone once told me, "Don't point out the problem, unless you are prepared to contribute to the solution"<P>so, I just wanted to see what people are doing to make things better if they think it is bad.

[BenG]

Serge, I agree about turning things off or finding alternatives to a lot of the pre-packaged cultural mediocrity. There is a lot of junk on TV, but I'll admit I'm a fan of 'The Simpons' as well. It has gone downhill in quality this season, but I still watch it. When it comes to comedy I'm not too discriminating. As long as a laugh is involved I'll like it. I'm also a big fan of the History channel. They recently had a biography on Mahler that I thought was well done.<P>As for trying to get the 'younger' generation interested in classical music (while at the same time avoiding coming across as snobbish, overbearing or judgmenta) I'm not sure how that can be done. Playing it in the background where kids congregate seems like a good idea. People can't be forced to like something and it would probably be better if they 'discovered' it for themselves. A lot of kids get familiar with the music via cartoons. That's good, too. Think of all the people who like classical music because they watched Bugs Bunny or Tex Avery when they were kids.<P>I don't know how recorded popular music in the last century will fare in the overall view of history. Bing Crosby was arguably the best pop singer of the 20th century. He had more top hits on the charts than Elivs or the Beatles. Now he's barely remembered--usually as an old guy pushing orange juice. I hope groups like the Beatles don't suffer a similar fate. I am confident that classical music will endure, however.

[shostakovich]

I'd like to pat Mazinga on the back for putting musical background to art appreciation classes. What age group are you dealing with? What music do you use?<P>As a general note, we (enlightened music lovers) have a good idea of what to listen to, what to avoid, and how to do it. Our own particular differences of opinion are not that significant. We share a common bond. It's those OTHERS, who don't know or care about the classics that we have to reach. They are not on the B.com boards. We have to try to reach out in subtle or direct ways to give THEM a link to the "good stuff". If it takes, great. If not, then it's not for them. Classical music is not for everyone (I'll wash my mouth out later). Look at converts as part of the glass half full (5% full would be great). I can't let loose of the jargon of religion, it seems. Go ye, and proselytize.<BR>Shos

[Bob the Composer]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by serge urtizberea:<BR><B>I love The Simpsons and will never stop watching that show so long as I have eyes in my sockets. I like Britney Spears' music (yes, I do) because a lot of it sounds symphonic to me. I like analyzing all those reality-tv shows and seeing mindless popcorn-blockbuster movies every now and then. </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>WHAT!!!!!!!!!!!!! Well, I'M NOT THAT INNOCENT anymore. <P>Seriously, though, it might as well be her or Ricky Martin if you go in for that stuff, they do have the best sound for today, though not always good content. I would say that the best pop group every to have existed were the Beach Boys, because they, I believe, honestly attempted to turn Pop music into a true art form with emotional expression, even more so than the Beatles.<P>I'm a big simpsons fan too, as you know, and I still think it can make great commentary on society today, though not with as much emotional content as previous years. But I still laugh, of course. I found their recent "Prisoner" parody very funny.<P>Regarding movies, I often try that as well, which I believe I hinted at in my post regarding the movie Hannibal.<BR>***<P>Regarding the origional post, you are absolutely right, Manzinga. I intend to compose and perform music so that it is more popular with the masses. We'll just have to see what happens.<P>Bob<p>[This message has been edited by Bob the Composer (edited 03-13-2001).]

[The Great Mazinga]

Shos,<P>I work with 8-12 year olds...I have found that if I do not push it on, them they come around. I play light or popular pieces, not complex, obscure ones....inevitably one or two will come up and ask questions...<P>take for instance the 1812 Overature and Aquarium....they do not generally know indepth about Napoleon or Saint-Saens, but they have all seen Beauty and the Beast and the Bad News Bears....both works were featured prominately in those movies.<P>That is the hook....have a conversation about the movies, cartoons, etc and then slowly work in the history behind it....pretty soon, they know more than they thought.<P>Ben, <P>By the way, I am in my 20's, so 10 years ago I was around your age...not too old now...but I listen to Bing Crosby, have his albums and watch his movies....Check out Going My Way...a bit old, but the message is still current...I also have Van Halen albums.<P>Those 10 years went fast.<p>[This message has been edited by The Great Mazinga (edited 03-13-2001).]

[provistbrahms]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by The Great Mazinga:<BR><B>witht the subtitle (what steps are you planning on to make it better)<P>Guess, the topic was too explosive for the board to handle, it was this post that caused the BB system to freak <P>Anyway, back to my original intention.....<P>For me personally, I have been reading many "rants" on the death of culture, music, art, society ad hoc....but the follow up and obvious question has not been forthcoming....seems like many find the arts to be in a state of decay....but what are you prepared to do to correct it?<P>Sounds kinda confrontational, but actually not, I just rather turn the energy into a positive and state what we are doing for ourselves and arts to help the situation...does not have to be Herculean tasks, but just everyday stuff...you may give someone inspiration.<P>(musical interlude)<P> "Hey, don't make it bad <BR> take a sad song and make it better <BR> Remember to let her under your skin <BR> Then you can begin to make it better"<P><BR>Stop contemplating and get active.<P>In this day and age were negativism has become chic and sexy and confused with wit, this might not appeal to some, but it is productive....I bet there are more positives out there amongst us all.<P>"For well you know that it's a fool <BR> who plays it cool <BR> By making his world a little colder" <BR>I agree with you to an extent. but changing ourselves isn't enough. Influencing other to better themselves will help to change society even faster. <P><BR>[This message has been edited by The Great Mazinga (edited 03-13-2001).]</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>

[Brahmsian]

My answer is simple. With every person I see I somehow get them to think about the classics. Provistbrahms and I (even though he is far away from me) are going to start a group. I even have a few potential members in my very small town. We will talk about classical music to everyone we know. Turning off the T.V. and doing that type of stuff is good for yourself but that is all. Try to get people to go to concerts with you, loan them tapes or CD's do whatever it takes. I am going to go into the musical performance and education field in college. This will give me an incredible amount of influence of exposing younger generations and my peers to the classics. Whatever it takes, sprending pahmphletes, holding rallys, holding amature concerts, giving free tickets, boycotting national television, going to only high moral movies, these are steps that should be taken and if enough people do enough things, it will have an effect

[The Great Mazinga]

Brahms and Brahms, Jr.<P>ok, not attacking here, but statments like "getting people to better themselves" is inflamatory to some...you asked, so..<P>Let me explain.....that phrase says volumes. that is your perception...and your values. Plenty of good, educated and productive people do not care for classical music...and they do not have to. They should not have to meet your values to be good people.<P>Plenty of creepy and narrow minded people do like it.<P>Appreciation for your thoughts and values is not mandatory criteria for someone to be good. <P>I disagree with the point that changing yourself is not enough:<P>I am rather fond of quoting lyrics, and here is one song that I live by, it is by the new wave, sometimes considered goth-like band from the 80's Depeche Mode.<P>You can't change the world<BR>But you can change the facts<BR>And when you change the facts<BR>You change points of view<BR>If you change points of view<BR>You may change a vote<BR>And when you change a vote<BR>You may change the world <P>know it, learn it, live it<P>Pax - Keep it Surreal<P>

[audiogirl]

Okay, guys. I have to get your take on this.<BR>Has Bing staked a claim on his rendition of "White Christmas?" Does everyone else's pale in comparison, or it just me? Peter and I talked about this.<P>I have the same weird contention about Yul Brynner in "The King and I."<P>Also, Mazinga, what do you think is the best Van Halen album? Please realize that the state of our cyber-friendship hinges greatly on your reply. Tee Hee.

[The Great Mazinga]

you are right on both accounts...White Christmas without Bing, can be good, but not great...at least not yet....<P>Yul has to be the king, The way he rattled off his etc. etc. etc. was toooo cool.<P>Just like he was the absolute dude in the Magnificient Seven and in the Ten Commandments.<P>as for VH? <P>obviously a set up for a fall due to the change in singers....my personal preference goes for almost a tie....1984 and 5150, although I am a big VH fan...have all their albums, except for the last one.<P><BR>SO LET IT BE WRITTEN, SO LET IT BE DONE!!!!

[Peter]

Audiogirl, There`s no question that Sarah Brightman`s would be THE definitive version of White Christmas, were she to ever record it (squeek! ) Mind you, I also think that Bing would have cut an excellent I Lost my Heart to a Starship Trooper.

[audiogirl]

Okay......Starship Trooper? Please inform me.<BR>Very few people can hit notes in the stratosphere and make it pleasing. Hence the phrase, "scream on pitch."

[BenG]

Taken from the book jacket of a nifty book I just bought:<P>"In the first half of the twentieth century, Bing Crosby was the king of popular culture. He was the number one movie attraction and the host of radio's most popular program. As a singer, Crosby still reigns supreme: he holds the most records for the most number one singles, the most singles to hit the charts, and the most popular song ("White Christmas") of all time. Bing Crosby was an innovator who practically invented modern pop singing, bringing a dramatic intimacy to records, radio and movies.<P>The book is "Pocketful of Dreams' by Gary Giddins.<P>I have many CDs of Bing's early stuff (mostly 1930s) and let me tell you he had a tremendous range of voice. It helped that he had some outstanding songs with wonderful lyrics. If anyone is interested I can recommend a recording or two. I'm an old fan of old jazz and pop tunes...and that's what I listen to when I'm not spinning classical CDs. Ok, I'll admit...I also have a fondness for the Moody Blues. But Bing was the 'real' king

[Peter]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by audiogirl:<BR><B>Okay......Starship Trooper? Please inform me. </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Audiogirl (btw, your name makes you sound like a superhero: "Oh no! The radio`s broken! Who can help us fix it? I know! AUDIOGIRL TO THE RESCUE!! ),<P>I digress............Before becoming Mrs Lloyd-Webber (& conveniently landing all those juicy stage roles), our Sarah led a risque dance troop called Hot Gossip, all leather-clinging outfits, whips & suggestive poses - not half bad, as it happens! - & in 1978, they made a single, ILMHTAST, with Sarah squeeking lead vocals. The disc reached no.6 here in the UK.

[audiogirl]

I have often thought that a few of sounded like musical superheroes. Let's see, there's Reedman, Hornplayer, Audiogirl, Classilady,....the list (or the beat) goes on.<P>I can't tell you how many times I've seen "Holiday Inn."

[The Great Mazinga]

Holiday Inn!!! An Inn, but what an Inn. I love that movie...the Astaire dance number, "Your Easy to Dance With" is a mandatory dance for at all family events. I love his style of dancing and Bing was fantastic too.....<P>"Which way to Connecticut? I have got a friend there that knows about women too."<P><BR>Speaking of Super Heros, don't forget The Great Mazinga....Invincible Guardian of World Freedom and a Protector of Roller Discos.<p>[This message has been edited by The Great Mazinga (edited 03-14-2001).]

[Peter]

Peter the Great?