Israel/Palestine et al... Who's Right?

[bignaf]

that's what I say. people like blaming "the regime" and "the extremists," as opposed to always good "Folk." (or Volk if you're Marx). in the case of Arab countries, what is harmful for most of the world is actually the Folk.

[barfle]

that's what I say. people like blaming "the regime" and "the extremists," as opposed to always good "Folk." (or Volk if you're Marx). in the case of Arab countries, what is harmful for most of the world is actually the Folk.

Again, I'm not so knowledgeable as to know what to do about Hezb' Allah, but I see religious fundamentalism (no matter what sect) to be the enemy of civilization. Ignorance is their tool, and they wield it well. Whenever I see someone who thinks "God" is on their side, I am immediately afraid, very afraid.

[GreatCarouser]

I received this link to a video from Al Jazeera a Saudi TV network from Piq's dad (of all people). You should view it ASAP because I don't know how long a 'shelf-life' it will have...

[BigJon@Work]

Syrian President Bashar al-Assad on Tuesday told the opening session of a journalists conference that Israel's war on Lebanon was a "planned aggression".

"The Israeli aggression against Lebanon was not connected with its kidnapped soldiers (by Hezbollah), but had been prearranged for a period of time," Assad said.

He said the resistance in Lebanon had achieved victory, adding the people's support had helped the resistance achieve this victory.

"We choose peace as a strategic choice, but it does not mean we exclude other choices and does not mean we have given up resistance," the president said

[BigJon@Work]

I received this link to a video from Al Jazeera a Saudi TV network from Piq's dad (of all people). You should view it ASAP because I don't know how long a 'shelf-life' it will have...

Linky don't work. What was it?

[Shapley]

Fascinating.

That woman has guts.

[analog]

Fascinating.

That woman has guts.

She speaks in short powerful sentences.

'The twentieth century owes its progress to Jewish scientists'

'You can believe in rocks, so long as you don't throw them at me.'

'....they treat women as beasts.'

There's no ambiguity. I like that style.

[Selma in Sandy Eggo]

Wow. Yes, that woman has guts and style. And she's correct.

I think she seriously annoyed that old guy in the hat, though. He rather proved her point, immediately labeling her a heretic. He's not used to arguing a point with a woman who uses facts and logic.

[Shapley]

He's probably not used to arguing a point with a woman who has the right to reply.

[bignaf]

wasn't disarming Hezbollah part of the ceasefire agreement? how can the Lebanese now say, "ummm... never mind, we don't want to"?
and why is Olmert taking the soldiers out, if Hezbollah isn't being disarmed, is acquiring more weapons and is taking up positions?

[bignaf]

awesome link GC.

[bignaf]

that's what I say. people like blaming "the regime" and "the extremists," as opposed to always good "Folk." (or Volk if you're Marx). in the case of Arab countries, what is harmful for most of the world is actually the Folk.

Again, I'm not so knowledgeable as to know what to do about Hezb' Allah, but I see religious fundamentalism (no matter what sect) to be the enemy of civilization. Ignorance is their tool, and they wield it well. Whenever I see someone who thinks "God" is on their side, I am immediately afraid, very afraid.

exactly, it shows they're stupid, since God is obviously on my side!

[GreatCarouser]

Wow. Yes, that woman has guts and style. And she's correct.

I think she seriously annoyed that old guy in the hat, though. He rather proved her point, immediately labeling her a heretic. He's not used to arguing a point with a woman who uses facts and logic.

Have no fear, I'm sure an Ayatollah somewhere has declared her heretic and there's a bounty on her.

[GreatCarouser]

Op-ed from The New York Times:

The New York Times
Printer Friendly Format Sponsored By

August 16, 2006
Op-Ed Contributor
Muslim Myopia
By IRSHAD MANJI

New Haven

LAST week, the luminaries of the British Muslim mainstream — lobbyists, lords and members of Parliament — published an open letter to Prime Minister Tony Blair, telling him that the “debacle” of both Iraq and Lebanon provides “ammunition to extremists who threaten us all.” In increasingly antiwar America, a similar argument is gaining traction: The United States brutalizes Muslims, which in turn foments Islamist terror.

But violent jihadists have rarely needed foreign policy grievances to justify their hot heads. There was no equivalent to the Iraq debacle in 1993, when Islamists first tried to blow up the World Trade Center, or in 2000, when they attacked the American destroyer Cole. Indeed, that assault took place after United States-led military intervention saved thousands of Muslims in Bosnia and Kosovo.

If Islamists cared about changing Iraq policy, they would not have bothered to abduct two journalists from France — probably the most antiwar, anti-Bush nation in the West. Even overt solidarity with Iraqi suffering did not prevent Margaret Hassan, who ran a world-renowned relief agency in Baghdad, from being executed by insurgents.

Meanwhile, at least as many Muslims are dying at the hands of other Muslims as under the boots of any foreign imperial power. In Sudan, black Muslims are starved, raped, enslaved and slaughtered by Arab militias, with the consent of an Islamic government. Where is the “official” Muslim fury against that genocide? Do Muslim lives count only when snuffed out by non-Muslims? If not, then here is an idea for Muslim representatives in the West: Go ahead and lecture the politicians that their foreign policies give succor to radicals. At the same time, however, challenge the educated and angry young Muslims to hold their own accountable, too.

This means reminding them that in Pakistan, Sunnis hunt down Shiites every day; that in northern Israel, Katuysha rockets launched by Hezbollah have ripped through the homes of Arab Muslims as well as Jews; that in Egypt, the riot police of President Hosni Mubarak routinely club, rape, torture and murder Muslim activists promoting democracy; and, above all, that civil wars have become hallmarks of the Islamic world.

Muslim figureheads will not dare be so honest. They would sooner replicate the very sins for which they castigate the Bush and Blair governments — namely, switching rationales and pretending integrity.

In the wake of the London bombings on July 7, 2005, Iqbal Sacranie, then the head of the influential Muslim Council of Britain, insisted that economic discrimination lay at the root of Islamist radicalism in his country. When it came to light that some of the suspects enjoyed middle-class upbringings, university educations, jobs and cars, Mr. Sacranie found a new culprit: foreign policy. In so doing, he boarded the groupthink express steered by Muslim elites.

The good news is that ordinary people of faith are capable of self-criticism. Two months ago, 65 percent of British Muslims polled believed that their communities should increase efforts to integrate. The same poll also produced troubling results: 13 percent lionized the July 7 terrorists, and 16 percent sympathized. Still, these figures total 29 percent — less than half the number who sought to belong more fully to British society.

Whether in Britain or America, those who claim to speak for Muslims have a responsibility to the majority, which wants to reconcile Islam with pluralism. Whatever their imperial urges, it is not for Tony Blair or George W. Bush to restore Islam’s better angels. That duty — and glory — goes to Muslims.

Irshad Manji, a fellow at Yale University, is the author of “The Trouble with Islam Today: A Muslim’s Call for Reform in Her Faith.”

[bignaf]

I'll try to meet Irshad Manji and give her props!

[shostakovich]

Hezbollah will not disarm. [Lieberman refused to accept "defeat", and he is not nearly as fanatical.] Giving up power is VERY hard for the powerful, especially those who think not what they can do for others. Hezbollah is actually doing for others. But they have declared "victory". Disarming is not what "victors" do.
Shos

[GreatCarouser]

I'll try to meet Irshad Manji and give him props!

I believe you should look for a 'her'....

[bignaf]

hmmm, do you know that? (I'm allowed to use punctuation now! it's past 12). because I never heard of a woman called Irshad!

[Shapley]

Shos,

RE:

But they have declared "victory". Disarming is not what "victors" do.

That's interesting. I seem to recall Saddam proclaiming himself victor after the first gulf war....

[Selma in Sandy Eggo]

hmmm, do you know that? (I'm allowed to use punctuation now! it's past 12). because I never heard of a woman called Irshad!

Irshad Manji, a fellow at Yale University, is the author of “The Trouble with Islam Today: A Muslim’s Call for Reform in Her Faith.”