Katrina

[piqaboo]

Haggis, since Clinton had no reputation to lose with Shap, he can hardly hurt himself!

[piqaboo]

At last!v
My employer has finally put together their hurricane relief program. Its been a bit slow in coming, but worth waiting for, as they will match the first $25,000 in employee contributions to the ARC.
[cynical] be sure their generosity will be well publicized locally [/cynical]
[practical] maybe the publicity will inspire others to do likewise [/practical]

Also, one of our choirs has adopted a family who was made homeless by the hurricane and who is relocating to San Diego.

I find myself wondering .... would I want the brand-new colored/patterned bedding someone donated? Or would I want to go buy my own choice? I think my answers would be very different depending on whether I was going back to my storm-ravaged home (all donations more than welcome) or starting over (let me choose my own, pretty please). I wonder why.

[Haggis@wk]

579
That’s the current death toll in Louisiana from the hurricane and catastrophic flooding. Terrible for the victims, their family, their friends.

But also much less than the 10,000 widely predicted.

And, BTW, much less than the more than
35,000 killed by a heat wave in Europe two summers ago.

Do you recall the debate that set off about European heartlessness, racism and discrimination?

No, neither do I.

[piqaboo]

Yes, I do. I was in Europe at the start of the heatwave, and followed it in the news when I got home.
Several countries set up programs to prevent a recurrance of the deaths due to heat, because the large majority of those who died were the elderly poor. There was serious outcry.

[Haggis@wk]

Piq,
My point was no one tried to turn it into a us vs. the poor, the blacks, the arabs, the (insert favorite minority here)

Katrina,

It’s become apparent that most of the "evidence" on the basis of which the Democrats launched their hysterical post-Katrina attack was wrong.

The dominant question that emerges is: how could the mainstream media have done such a poor job in reporting on Hurricane Katrina?

Here's the latest: The lurid reports of widespread criminality in New Orleans, and especially of crime and chaos at the SuperDome and Convention Center, were almost entirely untrue:

”Following days of internationally reported murders, rapes and gang violence inside the stadium, the doctor from FEMA...came prepared for a grisly scene: He brought a refrigerated 18-wheeler and three doctors to process bodies.

"I've got a report of 200 bodies in the Dome," [Louisiana National Guard Col. Thomas] Beron recalled the doctor saying.

The real total?

Six, Beron said.

Of those, four died of natural causes, one overdosed and another jumped to his death in an apparent suicide, said Beron, who personally oversaw the handoff of bodies from a Dome freezer....

At the Ernest N. Morial Convention Center, just four bodies have been recovered, despite reports of heaps of dead piled inside the building. Only one of the dead appeared to have been murdered, said health and law-enforcement officials.

That the nation's frontline emergency-management officials believed the body count would resemble that of a bloody battle in a war is but one of scores of examples of myths about the Dome and the Convention Center treated as fact by evacuees, the news media and even some of the city's top officials, including the mayor and police superintendent.

The vast majority of reported atrocities committed by evacuees — mass murders, rapes and beatings — have turned out to be false, or at least unsupported by any evidence, according to key military, law-enforcement, medical and civilian officials in positions to know.

"I think 99 percent of it is [expletive]," said Sgt. 1st Class Jason Lachney, who played a key role in security and humanitarian work inside the Dome.

Orleans Parish District Attorney Eddie Jordan said authorities have only confirmed four murders in the entire city in the aftermath of Katrina — making it a typical week in a city that anticipated more than 200 homicides this year.

"I had the impression that at least 40 or 50 murders had occurred at the two sites," he said.

"It's unfortunate we saw these kinds of stories saying crime had taken place on a massive scale when that wasn't the case. And they [national media outlets] have done nothing to follow up on any of these cases; they just accepted what people [on the street] told them. ...

It's not consistent with the highest standards of journalism."

The media's enthusiastic misreporting of falsehood as fact seriously damaged the rescue effort:

”Compass conceded that rumor had overtaken, and often crippled, authorities' response to reported lawlessness, sending badly needed resources to situations that turned out not to exist.”

It's time for some accountability here.
The conventional wisdom is that no one performed particularly well in the aftermath of Katrina--not local, state or federal authorities, and not considerable numbers of private citizens.

But it now appears clear that the worst performance of all was turned in by the mainstream media. Congress should promptly investigate, and try to get to the bottom of the following questions:

How did so many false rumors come to be reported as fact?

Do news outlets have any procedures in place to avoid this kind of mis-reporting? If so, why did their procedures fail so miserably?

To what extent were the false rumors honest mistakes, and to what extent were they deliberate fabrications?

To the extent that the false reports were deliberate, did the press pass them on through sheer negligence, or did some reporters participate in deliberate fabrication?

In deciding what stories to report, did the news media consider the likelihood that passing on false rumors would damage the rescue effort?

It is vitally important to get to the bottom of these questions, so that future natural disasters are not similarly misreported.

[OperaTenor]

Hi Haggis,

I wouldn't blame it all on the Democrats. Right now, I have a couple of hard right friends who are sending me chain e-mails telling stories about all of the violence and criminal activity conducted by poor vicitms of Katrina, all under the label of spoiled, lazy poor people.

I agree, however, that the MSM has done its usual abysmal job of gathering factual information and reporting in an unbiased fashion. It's just that I don't think they're[the MSM] liberal; they're lazy and profit-motivated, and as a result, go for the sensational stuff without bothering to research. Besides, it gives 'em two stories for the prices of one: First, they tell the rumors, then they come back later and dispell them when the facts get out.

[Haggis@wk]

I didn't mean to blame it on the Dems, just to point out they were the ones screaming the loudest about all the horror stories which turns out to be a tad untrue.

I agree that the MSM is lazy but I also beleive they are liberal in the sense that they take every opportunity to slam President Bush

[OperaTenor]

Originally posted by Haggis@wk:
I agree that the MSM is lazy but I also beleive they are liberal in the sense that they take every opportunity to slam President Bush

Nah, just lazy. He's an easy target.

[shostakovich]

And he's not a conservative regarding war, S.S.,Medicare, fiscal irresponsibility.
So it's not a matter of Liberals slamming a Conservative.

Personally, I think his "liberal" AND "conservative" policies almost all stink. The Roberts nomination may be OK. Even Bush can't ALWAYS be wrong.

And, by the way, I'm not on his case post Katrina. He's a dull-witted dufus, and did HIS best. However, the fiscal irresponsibility will reach an all time high in the aftermath. And it won't stop growing during his term.
Neither Liberal nor Conservative.

[OperaTenor]

Didn't anybody tell this idiot the "blame game" is off the talking points list?

Brown puts blame on Louisiana officials

His dismissal from overseeing the Katrina relief effort is the closest thing to an admission of fault, for ANYTHING, President PetroProfits has come to during his entire tenure as leader of the free world, which to me is the biggest indicator that he[Brown] was in fact incapable of doing the job. (i.e., PPP never offers up a sacrificial anode for appeasement)

The only thing that annoys me more than a whiner is an incompetent whiner.

[Shapley]

OT,

Glad to see you've made your mind up in the opening session of the hearings. His dismissal to remove a lightning rod from the Federal government. The Democrats want to dismiss the (Democratic) State and local leaders roles in the situation. They had hoped that, by Browns dismissal, he would become the whipping boy, and that they could use that to tar the entire administration.

Davis pushed Brown on what he and the agency he led should have done to evacuate New Orleans, restore order in the city and improve communication among law enforcement agencies.

Brown said: “Those are not FEMA roles. FEMA doesn’t evacuate communities. FEMA does not do law enforcement. FEMA does not do communications.”

He's right, you know. It's that Constitution thing. I might argue about the communications part of it, as that would seem to be a role in coordinating the response.

The story can be found here:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9496474/
I didn't see that text in the link OT posted.
______________________________________________

Here's what FEMA's web site says their role is:

Advising on building codes and flood plain management...teaching people how to get through a disaster...helping equip local and state emergency preparedness...coordinating the federal response to a disaster...making disaster assistance available to states, communities, businesses and individuals...training emergency managers...supporting the nation's fire service...administering the national flood and crime insurance programs...the range of FEMA's activities is broad indeed.

Note that it is tasked with: coordinating the Federal response to a disaster. I think some of our elected officials need to bone up on their Constitution before they start asking too many questions.

V/R
Shapley

[Shapley]

OT,

From the link you posted:

In a heated exchange, Rep. Christopher Shays questioned whether Brown did enough to coordinate the response.

"What would you like for me to do congressman," Brown asked the Connecticut Republican.

"That's why I'm happy you left," Shays said, "because that kind of, you know, look in the lights like a deer, tells me that you weren't capable to do the job."

Brown said he wasn't a dictator and couldn't make state or local officials do anything.

"I guess you want me to be the superhero that is going to step in there and suddenly take everybody out of New Orleans."

That is the point, really, they all want something to have been done, but they don't really know what was supposed to be done. Rep. Shays (a Republican) didn't have an answer, just an insult, to his response.

What were they to do, within the framework of their organization and responsibilities, that was not done? Until that question is answered, your terms such as "idiot", "whiner" and "incompetent" are premature, at least.

V/R
Shapley

Oh, Here's another excerpt from the hearings:

Brown told the committee investigating the government's response to Katrina that the Federal Emergency Management Agency had prepared well before the hurricane. FEMA had set up communications systems, held meetings in preparation and stationed key personnel and equipment in the area, but "out of harm's way" to prepare for the storm.

"FEMA pushed forward with everything that it had," but people continue to misinterpret the role of the agency, Brown told the committee

"Guess what, FEMA doesn't own fire trucks; we don't own ambulances; we don't own search and rescue equipment. In fact, the only search and rescue or emergency equipment that we own is a very small cadre to protect some property that we own around the country. FEMA is a coordinating agency. We are not a law enforcement agency," he said.

<small>[ 09-27-2005, 01:11 PM: Message edited by: Shapley ]</small>

[OperaTenor]

Well, for one thing, he could have mobilized the Federal repsonse a whole lot faster. Case in point: Response in the wake of Rita.

So yeah, "idiot", "whiner" and "incompetent" stick.

[Shapley]

OT,

What did FEMA do differently in the wake of Rita? Most of the credit for the the difference in responses lie with the Texas governor. I haven't heard him complain that he couldn't get his workers out on a sunny day. I didn't see FEMA taking over the State's role there. I didn't see Federal troops march into Galveston to maintain order. Did I miss something?

I agree the terms will stick, but not where you're trying to stick them.

V/R
Shapley

[OperaTenor]

So, if Brown's done such a good job, why did President PetroProfits, who has never demoted/fired anyone for anything, for one, take him off the job, and for two, accept his resignation?

As for what FEMA did differently, they were on the scene five days earlier in force than they were for Katrina. As for what state and local officials did, they probably did better than their LA counterparts. However, especially in terms of expediting evacuations, they learned a lot from Katrina.

I heard/read lots of stories of personnel and resources being strategically staged to respond to Rita, almost all of it attributed to the lessons learned from Katrina, not necessarily to the expertise of the local leadership in particular(although it is certainly to their credit to learn from what went wrong so qickly).

With all of the subjectivity in timelines these days, I'll refrain from trying to prove my point. For every timeline and document I can find to support my contention, I'm sure you can find one which will prove the opposite.

I think I'd rather spend my time drinking beer this time.

[piqaboo]

"...coordinating the federal response to a disaster...making disaster assistance available to states, communities, businesses and individuals"

Clearly someone non-democratic thought Mr Brown wasnt up to speed. They sent him to Washington and then they accepted his resignation.

I think most of the really bad pre-disaster management was in the NOLA mayor's office. AFter that, it spreads around a bit. But FEMA didnt hit the ground with all cylinders firing, clear internal communications, or any idea how to react when there was no place to set up the card tables.
It took 'em a while to figure it out. Be more understandable if there hadnt been the simulation just a year before (Haggis posted a link to that).

Make mine rootbeer, and please cap it with a scoop of vanilla, so the levee overflows!

[Shapley]

Apparently Brown, Blanco, and Nagin didn't click. I think Chertoff figured out that they respond to people in uniform, so he sent Brown back to Washington and replaced him with a Coastie.

Brown resigned, whether he was tired of the criticism or trying to deflect the heat, I don't know. OT has said (and I agree) it's not the President's style to offer him up as a sacrifice, so that wouldn't be likely.

The timeline I've posted previously shows that resources were put in place by FEMA, but not requested by the Governor. The power struggle was not merely between Federal and State, but also between State and local. From where I'm sitting, it looks like the bottleneck was in Baton Rouge. Yes, the local effort failed. Yes, the Federal government had resources available and in the area. Yes, the Governor had the authority, and the responsibility, to utilize them. Yes, it appears, she didn't.

But, I'm willing to hear the rest of the testimony, let the hearings play out (with or without the Democrats involvement.

Remember the old Civil Defense Agency we grew up with? The Feds provided them with the gas masks, anti-c's, geiger counters, etc., and the local officials set up shelters, stocked them, trained the people that would man them, and went to schools and businesses to make sure that everyone knew what to do in the event of a disaster. That is how FEMA is supposed to run. Are we supposed, now, to believe that our preparedness is best run by a bunch of beaurocrats in Washington? What, exactly, are these three layers of government between us and them supposed to be for?

V/R
Shapley

[OperaTenor]

And now, we find out Brownie's been given a golden parachute:

Brown serving as consultant to FEMA

This, from a more biased source(Project On Government Oversight):

"Brownie's Golden Parachute

In the ever growing “The Federal government is turning into the twilight zone” category, we now add this. Low and behold, Michael “Brownie” Brown, who resigned two weeks ago as head of the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) is still on the payroll as a “consultant.” So what can a man, whose expertise is in horses and not disaster response, consult on, exactly? The only thing we can think of is that everything Brown would recommend to FEMA, the agency would do the opposite, thus ensuring stellar performance.

Brown is testifying to the House Select Bipartisan Committee to Investigate the Preparation and Response to Hurricane Katrina on Katrina response right now. We hope members of the panel will ask Brown what his current role is at the agency. "

Just goes to show, that in the President PetroProfits administration, cronyism still pays off. Shoulda known......



<small>[ 09-27-2005, 04:20 PM: Message edited by: OperaTenor ]</small>

[Trumpetmaster]

This is outrageous if true...

[Shapley]

This, from a less biased source:

Brown resigned on Sept. 12 after running FEMA for more than two years. He has a two-week "transition" period remaining at the agency, during which he will advise the department on "some of his views on his experience with Katrina," Homeland Security spokesman Russ Knocke said. He is receiving full pay for the time that he is in an advisory role, which expires Oct. 12, one month after his resignation.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,170514,00.html