OperaTenor

[OperaTenor]

Very reminiscent of Major Medical, which I thought was great.

[Serenity]

OT, here are some useful medical definitions so they don't try to pull a fast one on you:

Artery: Study of paintings
Bacteria: Backdoor to cafeteria
Barium: What to do when treatment fails
Bowel: Letter like A E I O or U
Ceasarean Section: District in Rome
Cat Scan: Searching for Kitty
Cauterize: Made eye contact with her
Coma: Punctuation Mark
Congenital: Friendly
D & C: Where Washington is
Dilate: To live long
Enema: Not a friend
Fester: Quicker
Genital: Non-Jewish
Hang Nail: Coat Hook
Impotent: Distinguished, well known
Labor pain: Hurt at work
Morbid: Higher offer
Nitrate: Cheeper than day
Node: Was aware of
Outpatient: Person fainted
Post op: Letter Carrier
Recovery Room: Place to apholster
Rectum: Dang near Killed Him
Rheumatic: Amorous
Secretion: Hiding something
Tablet: Small table
Terminal Illness: Sick at Airport
Tibia: Country in North Africa
Tumor: More than One
Urine: Opposite of 'you're out'
Varicose: Nearby
Vein: Conceited

[dkm32]

Serenity:

I think you just got OT's vote for "The most helpful" on the Board Superlatives!! thread.

[Angie Parkes]

My experience (also Canadian) is much the same as Mary's: some terrible and tragic mistakes made, but no one denied care outright. But we definitely have a two-tier system here in Alberta. For example, when I broke my foot, I could get a plaster cast for free, or pay extra for the lighter weight poly cast. My mother-in-law and I both have osteoporosis. Her government plan won't pay for the second-generation drug we both need, only the first-generation. My private health care, supplied as a group plan through my employer, pays for the better second-generation drug.

There are some things that also don't make sense. My 3 year old son required Ventolin. I got a prescription for it, but had to pay for the Aerochamber that makes sure young children do breathe in the meds. I had chemotherapy for breast cancer last year. It was covered by the government's health care, but the anti-nausea drugs weren't. At $25 per pill (even in $Cdn that's a lot) I was fortunate that my private drug plan covered it, but others without coverage would have had to pony up on their own, or suffer the consequences. (Mind you since pot for medical reasons is legal in Canada I could have accepted a co-worker's offer of some of his stash for free....) Oddly, though, the government pays for my 5 years of a daily dose of tamoxifen, a drug that will help prevent a recurrence of cancer.

BTW, my insurance in Alberta (it varies from province to province up here) is $88 per month to cover my husband, two sons, and myself. Don't know how that compares with American insurance costs.

[Marye]

Oh my Angie.... how are you feeling?

[OperaTenor]

Angie, sorry to hear of your dilemas, but in the scheme of things, IMHO your lot is better than most Americans. That is not to belittle your problems, and I hope and pray they're put behind you quickly.

On a completely different (and potentially crass) note, Serenity, FOMCROTFLMREO!

[dai bread 1]

Originally posted by operatenor:
Mary, Lliam, DB, Ludovica, etc., how do you folks feel about your health care systems? Do you get what you need when you need it?

Sorry to take so long to reply, but I haven't been able to get to the board as often as I'd like.

We have a double-layered system here. There are private hospitals, funded by private insurance or, if you're rich enough, direct personal payment. Some of the private hospitals are actually fairly swept-up outfits, capable of doing heart work for instance.

Nevertheless, if you are seriously injured, as you were, or at death's door, you will go to the public hospital. The private hospitals are simply not set up to cope. We unwashed plebs who regard insurance as expensive and unnecessary also go there.

In the public hospital A & E dept., we wait upwards of 3 hours for treatment. We are usually fairly cursorily examined soon after arrival, and left to cool our heels, unless there is a possiblity of really serious illness. For instance, we have a lot of meningococcal disease here, for reasons which are not at all clear. If you show up with symptoms of flu, a rash, sore neck, you will be scrutinised in detail instantly on admission, because m. disease is lethal and fast. Several people have died of it lately because they weren't treated soon enough.

Eventually we are admitted to a ward, usually 4 or 6 to a room, and the treatment seems to vary considerably from ward to ward. At least it did when I was there, twice in (for me) quick succession. 1 abdominal op. and 1 fracture.

My abdominal op. got infected. I had to go to an outpatient dept. for several weeks while the wound, which had to be re-opened and cleaned out, healed from the bottom up. The fracture was treated conservatively, with first a plaster cast, then a lighter fibreglass one in electric blue, then what we call a moon boot (for obvious reasons once you've seen one).

It all turned out well in the end.

I know Americans will want to burn me at the stake for this, but I am a firm believer in socialised medicine. We spend about 7% of GDP on health care, and for that we get a system which will cope with most things, and do it to a standard as good as anybody else's. Some liver transplants have to be done in Australia, and I believe there are other similar things we can't do here, (we do heart transplants regularly) but there's not much we can't handle. Certainly we could have repaired O.T.'s mangled body.

I believe Americans pay about 17% of GDP, presumably via their insurance policies, for a system which, although the leader in its field, is fraught with the difficulties detailed in this thread. Our system has no such difficulties. The only time I ever had to deal with an insurance claim, it all went very smoothly. The existence of the public system keeps the private one honest.

We also have a thing called the Accident Compensation Corporation. This outfit looks after people who have accidents, wherever that might be. It covers sports, home handymen, motorists, etc etc. The result is that if you have an accident you can go to a private A & E and avoid the waits in the public system. Instead of waiting 3 hours plus, you'll wait less than 1 (usually) and ACC picks up about 80% of the cost. The trade-off is that we can't sue, so dead-heads just get done for traffic offences or whatever.

G.P.s are also heavily subsidised. Ours costs NZD 50 per visit, and that is considered expensive. We've been going to him for years though, and are reluctant to change. Also, when he rings the hospital and says "admit this man" they say "yes sir!" That doesn't always happen, so I'm told.

That's probably more than you wanted to know about our health system. We grizzle about it, but it works, and it's affordable.

<small>[ 07-17-2003, 10:00 PM: Message edited by: dai bread 1 ]</small>

[dai bread 1]

Originally posted by operatenor:

Mary, Lliam, DB, Ludovica, et. al., have you ever heard of a bona fide case in your health care system where a person who truly needed treatment was denied it, and that it was a failure of the system?

It depends what you mean by "failure of the system". We do have medical accidents here. For instance, a woman who turned up at a private A & E clinic with meningococcal disease that wan't diagnosed. She was sent home, where she died.

However, no-one is denied treatment that will help them; not even the freeloaders from overseas who don't contribute taxes here but feel it's o.k. to skip the country without paying. There was once a fuss over a man who was denied kidney dialysis, but he had so much else wrong with him he was on his last legs anyway.

[Serenity]

"Freeloaders from overseas"?

[dai bread]

Any NZ citizen is entitled to treatment in a public hospital as of right, so the question of freeloading doesn't arise. It is assumed that the citizen pays tax, or someone (e.g. a parent) does so on his or her behalf. It's very difficult to escape tax totally here, though some people try very hard.

I'm not sure what the arrangements are for other nationalities. I know there is some sort of deal for Australians, and for British, and for sundry Pacific Islanders under certain circumstances. However not all Islanders are covered, and neither are all illnesses and injuries, and some nationalities have no reciprocal deal at all. I think that is the case with the U.S.

The result is that foreigners go to our hospitals, usually as a result of accidents, and many don't bother to pay their bills. Islanders are usually uninsured, and strictly speaking their treatment should come from our foreign aid budget, but it's usually left in the health budget. We don't really mind Islanders getting free treatment, since we know they have no money and in any case there aren't very many of them, even by our standards. But North Americans and Europeans freeloading leaves a very bad taste in the mouth.

[OperaTenor]

Hi DB,

I am a supporter of "socialized medicine"/single payor health insurance. I believe it would guarantee equal access to health care for us and it would cost those of us who are trying to do the right thing and pay for health insurance less than we are currently paying.

Our health care providers make their fair share of medical mistakes, too.

[dkm32]

Keep in mind, folks. Even if we had "socialized medicine"/single payor health insurance. our payments would still be MUCH higher than Canada, England, etc.

Why, you might ask? Look at the cost of medicine in the US vs Canada! My Mom pays about $100 dollars for one medicine, that in Canada would cost her about $50. That's just one medicine! It's the US drug companies!!!

That's why all of those Canadian Pharmacy storefronts are popping up!

[dai bread 1]

That's why we have Pharmac, the govt. agency charged with buying medicines for the State hospital system and for State subsidies through the private pharmaceutical system. You should hear the cries of anguish from the drug companies!

Someone did some comparative pricing when Pharmac was set up. I forget the details now, but broadly we were paying twice what the Aussies paid for the same drug from the same company. We didn't stack up too well against other countries either, including the U.S, if I remember correctly.

Pharmac saves us millions of $ annually by being hard-nosed negotiators.

[Selma in Sandy Eggo]

If you could only check your local pharmacy's wholesale price listing, and then see the negotiated price listing for a major drug user. The different prices for the same drug vary hugely depending on the price negotiation. Even the grocery-store markup on non-prescription OTC drugs is often 500% to 1000%.

The whole socialized medicine/single payor concept would trim some of this back a bit, I'd think.

[Marye]

I am signing off for the weekend but I wanted to wish OT a bon voyage, a succesful tour with outstanding notices... or outSTANDING ovations.

Best wishes,

Mary

[shostakovich]

DIT! (short for "ditto", making it a Bignafian 1-syllable post ).
Shos (Heh, heh)

[lliam]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by operatenor:
Mary, Lliam, DB, Ludovica, etc., how do you folks feel about your health care systems? Do you get what you need when you need it?
--------------------------------------

I think Ludovica as said it for all of us, here in the UK.

Lliam.


The Princess Royal will be coming next week to officially open the new hospital that has been named after her.

******************************
Prevention is better that cure
*********************************
Ignatius, how do you expect to sing if your chewing a dandelion leaf?? “SPIT IT OUT BOY”

<small>[ 07-21-2003, 08:39 AM: Message edited by: lliam ]</small>

[Novus]

Originally posted by Angie:
I had chemotherapy for breast cancer last year. It was covered by the government's health care, but the anti-nausea drugs weren't. At $25 per pill (even in $Cdn that's a lot) I was fortunate ...

Not to trivialize your situation, but I thought I'd add some humor:
In Canada, you can get "another" drug for anti-nausea, and it's a lot cheaper than $25/dose. It's a lot better than the junk we get in the States, too.
-J

[Angie Parkes]

Sorry it took me a while to get back on the board; I've got to work *sometime*!

Many thanks for the good wishes, and I'm not in the least offended by humour or triviality. My first day at work when all my hair fell out, I wore all black, applied temporary tattoos, put on a Harley-Davidson skullcap and too much jewellery and had a ball as a biker chick. If you've got it, flaunt it, and if you don't, well, flaunt that, too!

Heaven forbid there's a "next time", but if there is, I think I might take advantage of the recently legal other drugs, perhaps baked in brownies. It would certainly be more fun.

There are certainly problems with the Canadian system of socialized medicine, but overall I have the idea that it's cheaper and certainly more widely accessible than the system of our US neighbours. I don't know how much my various and sundry treatments cost (some provinces send a statement so that one is aware), but I imagine the cost of treating breast cancer in the US would have been catastrophic to our family. Just the tests alone would have cost a fortune, I guess -- a bone scan, 2 bone density scans, a CAT scan, an ultrasound, an x-ray, and more blood work than I can remember -- not to mention the mammogram in the first place, ordered as a baseline screen merely because I was over 40. All that was "free", paid for through our tax system, but not money directly out of my pocket.

Anyway, in spite of its problems and idiosyncracies, the medical system came through when I needed it, and I think that's the case for the majority of Canadians.

[Marye]

Angie,

I'm thinking I could use some of that newly decriminalized drug myself... in sympathy-like

I hope you are doing better and a grand sense of humour is a must.