Moderator: Nicole Marie
OperaTenor wrote: GWB tried to do it by his ham-handed SS privatization scheme, and now Obama's succeeding where GWB failed.
Shapley wrote:OperaTenor wrote: GWB tried to do it by his ham-handed SS privatization scheme, and now Obama's succeeding where GWB failed.
Actually, the intent of SS privatisation was to remove the government from the loop. Monies that are currently payed by the employer and the employee to the government's coffers would be paid directly into a private account. The intent was to reduce government involvment in individual retirment plans, not to increase government control. President Bush was no socialist, although he did lay the groundwork for Mr. Obama's socialist agenda with his ill-concieved bailout.
Shapley wrote:I am inclined to accept Merriam-Webster as being more of an authority than Wikipedia. Merrian-Webster tends toward the actual definition of a word, whereas Wikipedia is subject to the interpretation-du-juor.
OperaTenor wrote:And of course, it doesn't hurt that it conforms to the position you wish to take.
Shapley wrote:I will acknowledge that I did not read the plan as submitted by the Congress or the Senate, which would be the plans that would actually get into law, if they made it to a vote. I did read the executive summary of the President's proposal, as well as the Heritage Foundations analysis of it, among others. The Congress' proposal was not the President's plan exactly. Nor do I believe the Senate's version to be. The president offered his outline only, as I recall.
However, you are avoiding answering my question. Why did the Democrats kill it?
OperaTenor wrote:Um, the scheme was never submitted by Congress or the Senate; it was never voted on. Check your memory banks.
Shapley wrote:OperaTenor wrote:Um, the scheme was never submitted by Congress or the Senate; it was never voted on. Check your memory banks.
H.R. 3304 Growing Real Ownership for Workers Act of 2005 (Introduced in House)
S. 1302 Stop the Raid on Social Security Act of 2005 (Introduced in Senate)
Privatization Plan: Fact and Fiction (A union website designed to generate opposition to the plan)
Shapley wrote:Yes, those are privatization models. They took the excess funds (social security surplus) and transferred them to private accounts. This differed from the Presidents' outline, which was to take a fixed percentage of social security funds and have them invested in private retirement accounts. The original outline was to have those private accounts paid directly to the private plans, not paid from the 'trust fund'. The Democrats argument was that the plan would kill social security and replace it with a system of private pensions (which was the long-term goal, true enough).
Your argument seems to be the opposite, that the privatization plan did not privatize Social Security, but rather gave the government control of private pension management. What basis do you have for this claim?
OperaTenor wrote:We went around and around about fascism here on this very board a few years ago, and I seem to recall having my nose rubbed in the notion that fascism was an economic philosophy primarily, and I'd swear it was by you, Shap.
Users browsing this forum: No registered users