Climategate

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Climategate

Postby Giant Communist Robot » Tue Dec 22, 2009 4:27 pm

From what I'd read it seemed clear that global warming was real, but there was some small case for it being a natural phenomenon. Most things pointed to warming caused by people. Those e-mails show some scientists have prioritized their politics over the truth. I know there are some here who feel this is OK, say on a school board level under certain conditions, but I don't. The incessant politicization of everything leads here, where the message becomes something that only has emotional appeal and the truth becomes irrelevant. In order to protect their own integrity those receiving said e-mails should have outed the authors immediately.

The proper domain of politics is politics.
Thinking is overrated
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Re: Climategate

Postby dai bread » Tue Dec 22, 2009 8:10 pm

Every time someone mentions Global Warming, there are reports of major snow and frost either here, if it's winter, or in the Northern Hemisphere if it's not. Like now, for instance. A good accompaniment for Copenhagen.

As far as scientific integrity goes, I think we may have seen the last of it until tenured researchers become the rule, and scientists no longer have to rely on grants. A physicist I know spends almost as much time applying for grants as he does on Physics, and in this country where funding is limited, he would be unwise to engage in controversial research. Luckily, there's nothing controversial about his field, so he does fairly well.

FWIW, I still think GW is a natural phenomenon, though I'm sure human activity isn't helping a bit. Or is, depending on how you look at it. As our own major climate man (Jim Salinger) said recently, if you put carbon dioxide into the air, you are increasing greenhouse gasses.
We have no money; we must use our brains. -Ernest Rutherford.
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Re: Climategate

Postby Shapley » Tue Dec 22, 2009 9:52 pm

Many of us have been pointing out for some time that there have been studies and reports that have disputed the 'consensus' view on AGW, but those were dismissed because the research was 'tainted' by the source of funding, namely that the funding was from corporations that may or may not benefit from a failure to regulate greenhouse gases. The primary value of the leaked e-mails is lies not in resolving whether or not global warming, or global climate change, exists, but in showing that the purity of the funding of consensus research is tainted no less. Rather than tossing out the research, it should now be weighed against the previously-dismissed research.
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Re: Climategate

Postby Haggis@wk » Wed Dec 23, 2009 10:37 am

My problem is that I'm fairly simple. If there is simultaneous global warming on Earth, Mars, and Venus, I have to think it might have something to do with the Sun. Like I said, simple minded.
The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public’s money.” Alexis De Tocqueville 1835
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Re: Climategate

Postby Giant Communist Robot » Wed Dec 23, 2009 12:54 pm

It should be clear now that global warming is a political phenomenon and will have a political solution. The ultimate truth here will be decided by some committee. Or in some cases, a school board.
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Re: Climategate

Postby dai bread » Wed Dec 23, 2009 4:35 pm

So long as it's not a priest. Environmentalism has distinctly religious overtones. (I use the word "priest" to designate a status of person, not to refer to established religion).
We have no money; we must use our brains. -Ernest Rutherford.
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Re: Climategate

Postby Haggis@wk » Wed Dec 23, 2009 5:38 pm

dai bread wrote:So long as it's not a priest. Environmentalism has distinctly religious overtones. (I use the word "priest" to designate a status of person, not to refer to established religion).


I think you are being generous using the word "overtones" I personally see it as a full blooded "Green" religion with it's own pope (Gore) and crusaders (the scientists) Maybe we can get one of those armed smurfs in Avatar to serve as a messiah.
The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public’s money.” Alexis De Tocqueville 1835
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Re: Climategate

Postby Haggis@wk » Mon Jan 04, 2010 3:04 pm

The stakes in “Climategate” have been increased enormously

This is why I am so glad to report that Michael Mann – creator of the incredible Hockey Stick curve and one of the scientists most heavily implicated in the Climategate scandal – is about to get a very nasty shock. When he turns up to work on Monday, he’ll find that all 27 of his colleagues at the Earth System Science Center at Penn State University have received a rather tempting email inviting them to blow the whistle on anyone they know who may have been fraudulently misusing federal grant funds for climate research.

Under US law, regardless of whether or not a prosecution results, the whistleblower stands to make very large sums of money: it is based on a percentage of the total government funds which have been misused, in this case perhaps as much as $50 million.


Someone is looking at a very, very big payoff.
The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public’s money.” Alexis De Tocqueville 1835
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Re: Climategate

Postby jamiebk » Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:35 pm

Haggis@wk wrote:The stakes in “Climategate” have been increased enormously

This is why I am so glad to report that Michael Mann – creator of the incredible Hockey Stick curve and one of the scientists most heavily implicated in the Climategate scandal – is about to get a very nasty shock. When he turns up to work on Monday, he’ll find that all 27 of his colleagues at the Earth System Science Center at Penn State University have received a rather tempting email inviting them to blow the whistle on anyone they know who may have been fraudulently misusing federal grant funds for climate research.

Under US law, regardless of whether or not a prosecution results, the whistleblower stands to make very large sums of money: it is based on a percentage of the total government funds which have been misused, in this case perhaps as much as $50 million.


Someone is looking at a very, very big payoff.


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