California!! It's Another Country!!

[dai bread]

Detroit's in a bad way. Does anyone still live there? Not according to that map.

[Haggis@wk]

Detroit's in a bad way. Does anyone still live there? Not according to that map.

And that was in 2008, I can't imagine what an updated map will look like. here's lil' ol' Collin Cty where I live All them damn yankees keep intruding!!!

[jamiebk]

Detroit's in a bad way. Does anyone still live there? Not according to that map.

And that was in 2008, I can't imagine what an updated map will look like. here's lil' ol' Collin Cty where I live All them damn yankees keep intruding!!!

As did you when you moved there! LOL

[Haggis@wk]

As did you when you moved there! LOL

Suh! I'll have you know I'm an American by birth but I'm a Southerner by the Grace of God!

[piqaboo]

I know an MD and a clinical scientist who are moving to Detroit next month.

[lliam]

Hey Guys, I'd like to hear your thoughts on this report, it's already happening in the UK.
=====================================================================================

USA Faces Demographic Crisis as European-Americans Slide into Minority Status

The demographic crisis which imperils Europe’s future also threatens the United States of America, a fact illustrated by this week’s news that European Americans will become a minority among newborn children in that nation next year.

The US Census Bureau’s (USCB) latest report announced that non-white births accounted for 48.6 percent of the children born in America between July 2008 and July 2009, gaining ground from 46.8 percent two years earlier.

This trajectory means that non-white births will pass European-American births within the next year.

In addition, the median age of the white population is older than that of non-whites. This means that a larger number of non-white immigrant women are of childbearing age, a situation aggravated by the fact that Third World populations tend to have much higher reproduction rates than Europeans.

Among the Hispanic population, there were roughly nine births for every one death, compared with a roughly one-to-one ratio for whites.

According to the census count, as of July 2009, whites constituted 65 percent of the American population. The rate of the white decline is astonishing: in 1960, they made up 85 percent of the population.

This figure is most certainly an underestimate as the US Census bureau counts all Middle Easterners (including people from North Africa and most of the Arab world) as “white.”

An August 2008 report from the USCB projected that by 2042, whites will be an absolute minority. This is a revision of earlier projections which projected this demographic change to take place in 2050.

By 2050, the USCB said, whites will have fallen to 46 percent of the population.

The Hispanic population will be more than 30 percent of the population by then, and the number of blacks will have risen to 15 percent. Asians are expected to rise to nine percent of the population by 2050.

Overall, the population of the United States is due to rise from 296 million in 2005 to 438 million, with 82 percent of the increase coming from Third World immigrants.

The total projected growth is equal to the combined populations of Great Britain, France and Spain. The 105 million extra people which will result from this immigration wave is equal to 13 additional New York Cities.

Hispanics accounted for 54.7 percent of the total population increase between July 2008 and July 2009, with 66 percent of that increase resulting from births in America.

As shocking as these figures are, they do not even include the impact of illegal immigration. According to the Center for Immigration Studies, an independent, non-partisan, non-profit research body widely regarded as an authority on the issue, in August 2007, the illegal population total stood at around 12.5 million. This means, in real terms, that there are probably more illegal aliens in America than there are blacks.

When this figure is added to the official totals, the demographic swing against European-origin America is even more marked. As all Third World immigrants have far higher birth rates than whites, then, when the legal and illegal immigration wave is factored in, it is likely that even the 2042 date for majority non-European America is optimistic.

The effects of this Third World immigration tsunami, which has reached into all parts of America, have been uniformly negative, quite apart from the long-term implications which will see that nation downgraded to Third World Status well before the end of the 21st Century

[lliam]

I've recieved this PM from an American Friend who wishes to remain annynimous why? beats me because I believe in free speech and letting people know I exist.
=======================================================================================

No longer proud to be an American

Submitted by Sympathetic American

I used to be a fiercely patriotic American, but as I learned of the declining population of true Americans, and as I observed the stifling liberalism that chokes our once-great nation to death each and every day, my patriotism gradually slipped away. It may well be too late to fix America, but all Americans who care about their nation, must try.
I recently took a trip to the Southern vacation town of Branson, MO (kind of like a miniature Las Vegas, but without gambling, instead they have shows and concerts and stuff). I felt like I died and gone to heaven. Why? Because virtually every single person there was white. Now, granted, they were mostly rednecks, but still it was very refreshing. And then I come home to my crime-ridden city where whites must already be a minority, and - wow, what a difference.
My hope for America is slipping, and so I have turned my attention to Europe, where so-called "radical" ideologies seem to do much better. Nationalism is on the rise in Europe. America is, possibly, doomed.
I would just like to thank The US Census Bureau for bringing up the demographic disaster that is affecting the US, and please, I beg the people of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland to wake up to what is happening in their own fair land, and those of you who already have opened your eyes, do everything in your power to make change (and no, I'm not talking about Obama-type change ) a reality. Keep England English, Scotland Scottish, Wales Welsh, and Ireland Irish. Also, don't forget to support nationalist parties in other countries as well. The Front National of France, Freedom Party of Austria, Party for Freedom of the Netherlands, Flemish League of Belgium, and Danish People's Party of Denmark are all doing quite well and have a chance of forming the majority of seats of their respective parliaments, sometime in the near future. Europe is the white man's only hope.
Goodbye and God bless.

[Shapley]

I've been to Branson, MO a number of times. I think it's a stretch to say that 'everyone there is white', but the Country & Western Music Mecca does have an appeal that draws mostly white folk, I suppose. One thing they do have there is a sense of patriotism, even to be found among the immigrant performers.

American flags fly everywehere there. Yakov Smirnov is there, with his brand of "I love this country" humour. There is a military museum that lives and breathes pride in America.

But there are non-whites to be found. There is a Chinese Acrobat theatre. Shoji Tabuchi is there playing country music on his fiddle. The Platters (yeah, I know, not the originals...) are there, with a fifties show that features a variety of performers.

American is not a white nation, so I'm a bit bothered by his suggestion that it should be. I do agree that those who settle here are supposed to pledge their allegience to the things we stand for, but one of those things is our welcome of foreign culture to blend with our own. We've always had our Chinatowns and Little Italys and Black Towns. They are as much of what America is about as is Branson, MO.

[analog]

Xenophobia is a primordial feeling. Does not Michener describe early Hawaiians drowning malformed infants?

I remember, with some shame, late fifties when we kids made jokes about Jewish and Black people. It was acceptable then. The town where I grew up, a suburb of Miami, had a covenant on property deeds to effect 'shall never be sold to someone not of Anglo Saxon race'. I went to segregated public schools and remember separate drinking fountains in local Margaret-Anne grocery store.. I was in my forties before ever got to know well any black person, Roy, an electronics technician at work. He was exceedingly kindhearted and wise and we talked at length about our travails raising our kids of about same age. He moved on to another job and I still miss him.
Point being that coming to know him made me aware of origin of my primordial reflex because it was so diametric to the genuine affection and respect i have for the man.

I would suggest to your friend that his 'uniformly negative effects' are more social than genetic; any population deprived of a sense of usefulness and worth is ripe for mischief (1930's Germany). Here in the very white Ozarks we have our drug dens, thieves, indolence and domestic violence. As i'm sure the poorer parts of any European city does for William Blake was writing about it in 1500's London.

As unpalatable as PC is we need to consciously work on our inborn xenophobia. It's part of the price for this many people on the planet. Start is to recognize it and that was one of Roy's many gifts to me.

Your friend might enjoy Eric Hoffer's "Temper of our Time". He has a wildly un-PC chapter "The Negro Revolution", that addresses the social and psychological side of the matter.

humbly, a.

[lliam]

Ok so, your'e a fogiving nation. I'd like your thoughts on this little snippet.
=======================================================================

Islam 4 USA

It's a double wammy for America; Islam has now become a force to be reckoned with their. Not only are they threatened with a radical imam wanting to put up a 13 storey mosque 600 yards from Ground Zero but Saudi Arabia has plans for the new twin towers. The following video was removed from air by Fox News not long after it aired but I found it on a random website:

http://wejew.com/media/8730/WTC_Scandal ... _Own_and...

[analog]

That one doesn't load now, guess they found it.

Yes we're pretty forgiving but "good fences make good neighbors" and we can stand up on our hind legs and get ferocious.

Around here there is outrage over that mosque idea. Perceived as mischief by a few arrogant people who instead of offering amends instead want to rub it in. That crosses the fence.

a.

[Shapley]

We've probably been too accomodating of the Muslim world. As I noted, we expect immigrants to America to pledge allegiance to our nation's foundations and laws. The vast majority of Muslim immigrants that I've met do so, but we have been too accomdating of the radical element that do not. You can read about that in Haggis' "U.S. Shari'a watch" thread, and elsewhere here on the board.

It's not unique to our treatment of Muslims, mind you. We have also been too accomodating of radical elements from other cultures. Attention is drawn on the Muslim because of the current war, and on the Hispanics because of the situation in Arizona, but there are others.

I find the idea that we allow people who are here illegally to parade openly in the streets demanding their 'due' repugnant. But such is America today. Our president cannot pull himself to point out that radical Muslims who commit crimes in America are either radical or Muslim. Nor can he, apparently, get a grip on the idea that being here illegally is illegal. He now plans to sue Arizona to overturn their law that recognizes that fact.

I'm not opposed to developing a national identity. I'm opposed to the idea that such an identity is a 'white' identity, as the author of the letter seems to suggest. Our heritage is one of many nations, forged together under a common set of laws and ideals. It is those laws and ideals that make us American, not the colour of our skin.

[lliam]

[You can read about that in Haggis' "U.S. Shari'a watch" thread, and elsewhere here on the board.]


An ex Muslim freind keeps in touch and we go to the Capital sometimes to protest against sharia law unfortunately I couldn't make it this time but here's her report.
===================================================

From: Maryam Namazie (m.namazie@onelawforall.org.uk)
Sent: 22 June 2010 12:07:10
To: lliam@hotmail.com
1 attachment
powerphpl...png (2.4 KB)


Several hundred people joined One Law for All on 20 June at Downing Street to show their opposition to Sharia and religious-based laws in Britain and elsewhere and to demand universal rights and secularism.

A new report “Sharia Law in Britain: A Threat to One Law for All and Equal Rights” (http://www.onelawforall.org.uk/new-repo ... al-rights/) was published on the day to coincide with the rally. Human rights activist Gita Sahgal said of the report: “I think it is highly significant that in Britain there has been silence where there should have been condemnation. There is active support for ‘Sharia laws’ precisely because it is limited to denying women rights in the family. No hands are being cut off, so there can’t be a problem. Unfortunately for us, senior law officers will find that human rights expert bodies often have a similar attitude. They have done little research on the impact of family laws and the denial of justice caused by parallel systems of justice. That is why the findings of this report are so important. It is such dedicated work that changes the thinking of the experts.”

She went on to say: “This campaign stands at the heart of a debate over the future of Britain. It also stands at the heart of global attempts to destroy the most basic rights, to invade liberty and to crush equality and to do this in the name of upholding and promoting human rights. We stand here today facing down forces of racism and fundamentalism as we struggle for secularism.”

The pro-Sharia Al-Muhajiroun organised a counter-demonstration to the One Law for All rally. One of their members said: “We find many of these people who call for human rights and one law. They come and they say that they want equality. But what equality do you get when one man legislates over another?” In response, One Law for All Spokesperson, Maryam Namazie, said: “The fight against Sharia law is a fight against Islamism not Muslims, immigrants and people living under Sharia here or elsewhere. So it is very apt for the Islamists to hold a counter-demonstration against our rally. This is where the real battleground lies. With a few members of the far Right English Defence League also there to showcase their bigotry, it became abundantly clear to everyone why our Campaign is fast becoming the banner carrier for universal rights, equality, and one secular law for all in this country and beyond.”

MC Fariborz Pooya of the Iranian Secular Society said: “The One Law for All Campaign has brought to centre stage an important debate about the kind of society we want to live in whilst defending the rights of everyone irrespective of religion, race, nationality…; this Campaign is truly the voice of the voiceless.”

Women’s rights campaigner Yasmin Rehman said: “We Muslims have been a part of the UK for many, many years but the generations before me did not feel the need for or call for segregation in the way that is being demanded now. At the beginning of my career as a women’s rights advocate there was no need to apply for a certificate of Khula in divorce cases. Muslim women are now being told that divorces under the English legal system are not valued or recognised without a certificate of Khula – and should they remarry without this they will be committing Zina – a ‘crime’ punishable by death in many Muslim countries. This is not a view shared by all Islamic scholars but a view that is being pushed through the Islamic councils and tribunals across the UK.”

Anna Waters of One Law for All’s Legal Team said: “Any reasonable interpretation of the Human Rights Act shows us that there are certain things that it doesn't allow - and one of the things it doesn't allow is for a woman to have an inferior or second class status when she stands before a judge in a court of law. This is exactly what is happening…”

Sue Robson of the Gay And Lesbian Humanist Association said: “This is a human rights issue. Here in the UK, it’s an egalitarian issue; it’s a feminist issue. Elsewhere in our world, the issue is life - and death.”

Gerard Phillips of the National Secular Society said that Sharia Law was “nothing less than an attack on human rights and on equality.” He went on to say: “It undermines our democracy. It must be opposed.”

The rally also heard from others including Naomi Phillips of the British Humanist Association, poets from the Anti-Injustice Movement and singer Adam Barnett.

Protestors then joined a march organised by Iran Solidarity to the embassy of the Islamic regime of Iran. Patty Debonitas of Iran Solidarity UK said: “By coming today you are showing your solidarity with the people here who are victimised under Sharia law and people in Iran who are being victimised under the state power of Sharia.” The rally was held on 20 June to mark the killing of Neda Agha-Soltan at a protest in Tehran last year and link the fight against Sharia here with that in Iran and elsewhere.

On the day, Maryam Namazie was interviewed on BBC 1 TV's Breakfast Programme, and some other media outlets.

Notes:

1. The new One Law for All report “Sharia Law in Britain: A Threat to One Law for All and Equal Rights” can be downloaded free of charge or a paperback copy purchased from One Law for All for £5.00 plus £2.00 Shipping and Handling. To purchase the book or donate to the work of One Law for All, please either send a cheque to our address below or pay via Paypal by visiting: http://www.onelawforall.org.uk/donate/. One Law for All wants to send the report to MPs, the Archbishop of Canterbury and others. It would be very helpful if you could buy extra copies for us to send on to others free of charge.

2. Full speeches of speakers will be available on the website soon as will video footage of the day. Photos can be found here: http://www.onelawforall.org.uk/successf ... aws-in-uk/.

3. The One Law for All Campaign was launched on 10 December 2008, International Human Rights Day, to call on the UK Government to recognise that Sharia and religious courts are arbitrary and discriminatory against women and children in particular and that citizenship and human rights are non-negotiable.

4. For further information contact:
Maryam Namazie
Spokesperson
One Law for All
BM Box 2387
London WC1N 3XX, UK
Tel: +44 (0) 7719166731
onelawforall@gmail.com
www.onelawforall.org.uk

[piqaboo]

European Americans have been a minority in this land before.
Not sure what it matters.
I am more concerned about the 'you owe it to me' Americans who seem to be replacing the 'I earned it' Americans.

[analog]

Sharia and religious courts......???

I guess i just wasn't paying attention.

From The Sunday Times
September 14, 2008

Revealed: UK’s first official sharia courts
Abul Taher

ISLAMIC law has been officially adopted in Britain, with sharia courts given powers to rule on Muslim civil cases.

The government has quietly sanctioned the powers for sharia judges to rule on cases ranging from divorce and financial disputes to those involving domestic violence.

Rulings issued by a network of five sharia courts are enforceable with the full power of the judicial system, through the county courts or High Court.

Previously, the rulings of sharia courts in Britain could not be enforced, and depended on voluntary compliance among Muslims.

It has now emerged that sharia courts with these powers have been set up in London, Birmingham, Bradford and Manchester with the network’s headquarters in Nuneaton, Warwickshire. Two more courts are being planned for Glasgow and Edinburgh.

Sheikh Faiz-ul-Aqtab Siddiqi, whose Muslim Arbitration Tribunal runs the courts, said he had taken advantage of a clause in the Arbitration Act 1996.

Under the act, the sharia courts are classified as arbitration tribunals. The rulings of arbitration tribunals are binding in law, provided that both parties in the dispute agree to give it the power to rule on their case.

Siddiqi said: “We realised that under the Arbitration Act we can make rulings which can be enforced by county and high courts. The act allows disputes to be resolved using alternatives like tribunals. This method is called alternative dispute resolution, which for Muslims is what the sharia courts are.”

The disclosure that Muslim courts have legal powers in Britain comes seven months after Rowan Williams, the Archbishop of Canterbury, was pilloried for suggesting that the establishment of sharia in the future “seems unavoidable” in Britain.

you guys gotta undo that.


a.

[dai bread]

I wonder what would happen if I trod (metaphorically) on some alleged Muslim's toes while in Britain. Would I be tried under British law or some interpretation of Muslim law?

Anyone in a country, visitor or local, should expect to abide by its laws. To expect otherwise is to foment rebellion.

[lliam]

[quote="dai bread"]I wonder what would happen if I trod (metaphorically) on some alleged Muslim's toes while in Britain. Would I be tried under British law or some interpretation of Muslim law?


I'm Sorry DB, You would have your feet cut off (metaphorically)

[analog]

I've recently come to admire the genius in Lincoln's " Lyceum Address" .
He warned that in difficult times of (then) recent past a pretty good mechanism of laws had been evolved. Now that times were easier the temptation to undo the mechanism would be strong for the forces of ambition.

Many great and good men sufficiently qualified for any task they should undertake, may ever be found, whose ambition would inspire to nothing beyond a seat in Congress, a gubernatorial or a presidential chair; but such belong not to the family of the lion, or the tribe of the eagle. What! think you these places would satisfy an Alexander, a Caesar, or a Napoleon?--Never! Towering genius distains a beaten path. It seeks regions hitherto unexplored.--It sees no distinction in adding story to story, upon the monuments of fame, erected to the memory of others. It denies that it is glory enough to serve under any chief. It scorns to tread in the footsteps of any predecessor, however illustrious. It thirsts and burns for distinction; and, if possible, it will have it, whether at the expense of emancipating slaves, or enslaving freemen. Is it unreasonable then to expect, that some man possessed of the loftiest genius, coupled with ambition sufficient to push it to its utmost stretch, will at some time, spring up among us? And when such a one does, it will require the people to be united with each other, attached to the government and laws, and generally intelligent, to successfully frustrate his designs.

Distinction will be his paramount object, and although he would as willingly, perhaps more so, acquire it by doing good as harm; yet, that opportunity being past, and nothing left to be done in the way of building up, he would set boldly to the task of pulling down.

Here, then, is a probable case, highly dangerous, and such a one as could not have well existed heretofore.

The idea of Islamic law creeping into an established system scares me, particularly if it's not written out but decided ad-hoc by a self appointed and ambitious priesthood. That's mighty close kin to the Mobocracy that inspired Lincoln's address.

Lincoln's prescribed antidote was education and reverence for the law of the land.

Let reverence for the laws, be breathed by every American mother, to the lisping babe, that prattles on her lap--let it be taught in schools, in seminaries, and in colleges; let it be written in Primers, spelling books, and in Almanacs;--let it be preached from the pulpit, proclaimed in legislative halls, and enforced in courts of justice. And, in short, let it become the political religion of the nation; and let the old and the young, the rich and the poor, the grave and the gay, of all sexes and tongues, and colors and conditions, sacrifice unceasingly upon its altars.

I think the laws of the land is a place where xenophobia should be allowed its natural function of self preservation. Why go back toward something that predates the age of enlightenment? (Does this make me a conservative?)

How'd you guys let that Sharia law creep into your system ? I noticed in Haggis' Sharia thread a post by Marye that Canada ended their experiment with it in 2006. Postby Marye » 12 Mar 2007 01:37 pm , bottom of page 1.

I hope it gets shouted down here. Lincoln's address was in i think 1838, not exactly recent history but recent enough the dialect of the time is still pretty easy to read and understand.

Of course being a social klutz i liked his closing thought:

Passion has helped us; but can do so no more. It will in future be our enemy. Reason, cold, calculating, unimpassioned reason, must furnish all the materials for our future support and defence.

a.

[Haggis@wk]

California says whooping cough is at epidemic levels

This is a vile, vile disease made even worse by the fact it is so preventable in children. When we were in England in the late 70s and early 80s there was an epidemic in the English school the boys attended and the school nurse, who was required to give vaccine shots to all the students was surprised when she learned that ALL of the American students had already been immunized. Hardly any of the English kids had been immunized.

I was shocked awhile back when I heard that horrible cough while waiting in my doctors office. Two kids, apparently siblings, had it and hearing that distintive cough gave me chills.

[dai bread]

Whooping cough was common when I was a boy. It's another reason I detest the anti-vaccination brigade.