Population

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Re: Population

Postby Haggis@wk » Tue Jun 21, 2011 5:20 am

shostakovich wrote:Once in a while there will be a letter or article regarding overpopulation. It's the problem no elected official will take on. The standard methods of population control are war, starvation, disease. Surely we can find a better way. Shos


Well, Shos, the world just found one, good luck with it.

[url=http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303657404576361691165631366.html]The War Against Girls

Since the late 1970s, 163 million female babies have been aborted by parents seeking sons[/url]

Mara Hvistendahl is worried about girls. Not in any political, moral or cultural sense but as an existential matter. She is right to be. In China, India and numerous other countries (both developing and developed), there are many more men than women, the result of systematic campaigns against baby girls. In "Unnatural Selection," Ms. Hvistendahl reports on this gender imbalance: what it is, how it came to be and what it means for the future.

In nature, 105 boys are born for every 100 girls. This ratio is biologically ironclad. Between 104 and 106 is the normal range, and that's as far as the natural window goes. Any other number is the result of unnatural events.

Yet today in India there are 112 boys born for every 100 girls. In China, the number is 121—though plenty of Chinese towns are over the 150 mark. China's and India's populations are mammoth enough that their outlying sex ratios have skewed the global average to a biologically impossible 107. But the imbalance is not only in Asia. Azerbaijan stands at 115, Georgia at 118 and Armenia at 120.

What is causing the skewed ratio: abortion. If the male number in the sex ratio is above 106, it means that couples are having abortions when they find out the mother is carrying a girl. By Ms. Hvistendahl's counting, there have been so many sex-selective abortions in the past three decades that 163 million girls, who by biological averages should have been born, are missing from the world.

Moral horror aside, this is likely to be of very large consequence.
The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public’s money.” Alexis De Tocqueville 1835
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Re: Population

Postby piqaboo » Tue Jun 21, 2011 5:00 pm

One consequence = lots of future bachelors.
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Re: Population

Postby Haggis@wk » Tue Jun 21, 2011 8:29 pm

piqaboo wrote:One consequence = lots of future bachelors.



Frequently in history an over abundance of males leads to violence
The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public’s money.” Alexis De Tocqueville 1835
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Re: Population

Postby Giant Communist Robot » Wed Jun 22, 2011 11:26 pm

The solution is ....polyandry.
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Re: Population

Postby Giant Communist Robot » Thu Jun 23, 2011 2:01 am

what about gay marriage?
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Re: Population

Postby Haggis@wk » Tue Jun 28, 2011 8:32 am

The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public’s money.” Alexis De Tocqueville 1835
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Re: Population

Postby Shapley » Tue Jun 28, 2011 8:38 am



Methinks this puts the family tradition in peril,
since such modified offspring would be sterile.
They might have the tools to qualify as a 'son',
but following the lineage, they would be the last one.
Quod scripsi, scripsi.
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Re: Population

Postby piqaboo » Tue Jul 12, 2011 8:11 am

Haggis@wk wrote:
piqaboo wrote:One consequence = lots of future bachelors.



Frequently in history an over abundance of males leads to violence

Indeed, a time-honored, if unpleasant, way to reduce the number of available males.

I suspect the societal role of women is more open and equal when they are in excess, rather than being seen as a precious commodity that needs to be controlled and bartered for power (dowry, etc).
Altoid - curiously strong.
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Re: Population

Postby Haggis@wk » Tue Aug 14, 2012 1:57 pm

It appears that one major effect of the Great Recession from 2008 through now is that Americans are having fewer babies, as reported in The Economist and displayed in the chart below. As The Economist notes:

CONSERVATIVE Americans like to contrast the vigour and virility of their own country with the decadence and decline of Europe. Demography is exhibit A in their argument. Mitt Romney, for example, talked about Europe’s “demographic disaster” as he ended his presidential bid in 2008, calling it “the inevitable product of weakened faith in the creator, failed families, disrespect for the sanctity of human life and eroded morality”.


Image

Since most of the article is behind a subscription paywall, here’s the best bits:

Population really starts to take off, though, after World War II. In the second half of the 20th century, global population more than doubles, from roughly 2.5 billion in 1950 to almost 6 billion in 2000. And the data show that, in material terms at least, individual well-being (as measured by global per capita income) takes off at exactly the same time as population.1

This doesn’t necessarily mean that the observed increase in population directly caused the observed increase in per capita income; nor does it mean the reverse, for that matter. It just means that the two processes—increasing population and increasing wealth on a global scale—have been strongly correlated over the past two millennia.


And especially this conclusion:

Predictions of demographic disaster, consistently pushed back for the two centuries since Malthus, are finally reaching their expiry date.


Unlike some in the past, Shos for one, I’ve always been a proponent of population growth in the U.S. I’ve long felt that people have always been our most important resource and one that cannot be overcome by technology.

This comes as very disturbing news to me personally.
The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public’s money.” Alexis De Tocqueville 1835
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Re: Population

Postby Shapley » Fri Aug 17, 2012 8:18 am

It doesn't surprise me at all that the fertility rate decline happens to coincide with the rise of Democrats to power. Declining fertility rates are frequently linked to a lack of hope for the future.

"You have hurled the worst fear
that could ever be hurled
fear to bring children
into the World..."
- Bob Dylan - "Masters of War"

BTW, it's good to hear from you, Haggis. I was about to send a posse down to Texas to locate you...
Quod scripsi, scripsi.
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Re: Population

Postby Haggis@wk » Fri Aug 17, 2012 9:56 am

Well, it's hard to argue in a vacuum and I sense the days of BB.com are mostly behind us. I suspect most of our malcontents have moved on to other venues. OT's certainly making a pest of himself on Facebook and I've all but decided to kill my Facebook page. It's been nice to track family but it's become such a polarizing political magnet that I no longer even read my page, haven't for months.

BBB always seemed more "civilized" than the Facebook universe where comments are fast, immediate and frenquently without reflection. I always take my time to review my comments and often revised and remove inflamatory comments, on Facebook; not so much.
The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public’s money.” Alexis De Tocqueville 1835
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Re: Population

Postby Shapley » Fri Aug 17, 2012 12:03 pm

Facebook is a wasteland of cut-and-paste these days. I'm there regularly, because I use it to share photos and discuss topics, but most of those 'on the left' only want to discuss topics with people who agree with them. 'Debate' seems to consist solely of clicking 'like'. If you disagree, you'll be pounced upon. This is true, methinks, of both sides of the isle. I've been 'defriended' by right and left for offering opposing opinions on cut-and-paste links.

And I'm tired of the 'click share if...' links. Am I supposed to feel guilty because because I didn't share the photo of the sad puppy or the kid waving the flag? I don't. I don't like people telling me what I need to put on my own status, even if it facebook that officially 'owns' that status...

Oh, well, enough rant for the day. I reckon I'll just call you next time you go missing... :)
Quod scripsi, scripsi.
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Re: Population

Postby Shapley » Fri Aug 17, 2012 2:59 pm

Haggis@wk wrote:Image


Hmmm. The chart shows the decline in the stork market preceeding the decline in the stock market by about 9 months...
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Re: Population

Postby dai bread » Fri Aug 17, 2012 9:18 pm

If this was Facebook, I'd click "like" for that last sentence, Shap.
We have no money; we must use our brains. -Ernest Rutherford.
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Re: Population

Postby barfle » Mon Sep 10, 2012 7:33 am

Haggis@wk wrote:It's been nice to track family but it's become such a polarizing political magnet that I no longer even read my page, haven't for months.
I have yet to join the facebook lemmings - perhaps it's because I'm such a luddite, or perhaps it's because I already have too many distractions in my life.

I still have so many projects in my house that I tell people I live in the projects.

But it's a shame to see the BBB so quite. It used to be a lot of fun, with plenty of intelligent discussion from all around. Even near Washington, DC.
--I know what I like--
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