What exactly characterizes classical music?

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Re: What exactly characterizes classical music?

Postby priya978 » Tue Dec 24, 2002 1:51 am

You know what Jim. <BR>I AGREE WITH YOU!!!!!<BR>On his piano works at least. His orchestral works I can tolerate because of the different colours, timbre, etc. that each instrument has, but his piano, harpsichord, clavier, etc. those are uhhhhhhh, (sigh) tiresome, in a (very subtle) word. that why I never and probably never will play his works. I've tried his music (preludes mostly) endless times, but I just can't do it. That's partly why I have yet to audition for the MTNA. Ah, I've said what there is to say just very loosley, so magnify everything about a hundred times, then there's me and my thoughts. I wonder if I ever make recordings if that'll be a feature of my conducting, piano-playing, etc. Exaggeration. Hmmmm?
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Re: What exactly characterizes classical music?

Postby bignaf » Tue Dec 24, 2002 2:03 am

Eugene, try the 2 part inventiones. you can't be a musician without playing Bach. bach is amazing you should give him anotjer chance, don't expect a romantic emotional wallop. listen to the tight construction to the amazing counterpoint to the interweaving of the lines to the relationship between all the elements of the piece. I still don't like Bach's not so cotrapunctal stuff like his slow ,opvements. I don't like his melodies so much as pure melodies and that is what he's trying to acheive in those slow movements.<BR>bach is hard to play because of the independence of the parts and the continous (overlapping) style of the musicdon't be lazy play it!
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Re: What exactly characterizes classical music?

Postby priya978 » Tue Dec 24, 2002 2:22 pm

What I think of amazing, genius, excellent, beautiful counterpoint would be in Beethoven's Ninth the basson part after the bass ("mysterious") opening of the joy theme. The basson part.<BR>And I've tried his music endless times, I just can't stand his piano music, violin music is fairly good, but piano ughh.<BR>And I don't have a problem with the polyphonics, when I sight-read his polyphonic music I do fairly well, it's just it's lack of music, in the piece, it makes it sooooooo boring, tiresome.<BR>And RIGHT after my previous post on this topic I went straight to my keyboard and learned his prelude No.2 in Cmoll, from the well-tempered clavichord. All I need now is the speed, speed it up a little and it'll be perfect. It took me so long (hours actually) because I am so strict with myself on getting each and every single right-hand note timed exactly with each and every single left-hand note. Which, if you know the part, makes it very challenging.
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Re: What exactly characterizes classical music?

Postby bignaf » Tue Dec 24, 2002 4:46 pm

If you only try his preludes i'm sure you won't like Bach. try his Fugues.
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Re: What exactly characterizes classical music?

Postby Rustle » Thu Dec 26, 2002 9:59 am

So Shreidi, what exactly characterizes classical music... who knows?! It's a philosophical question right up there with God and time. :)<P>Bach... Let's remember that Bach devoted his life to church music. Other music that he wrote was often for study, as he was an educator too... when he showed up to teach that is. So things like the Cello suites, Art of..., The Well-tempered... were written more as etudes to develop players "chops" on their instruments. Well sure, Brahms wrote some more melodic etudes, but you can't discount the value in the Bach etudes. The independence of the lines is often a huge challenge. Also, if you can make some music happen in a WTC prelude, you can shine on some Debussy or Beethoven. You must also admit that he knew counterpoint very well and he set the standard for Western harmony. <P>I agree, Bach can be a bit dry in large doses. I like his music a lot in short doses. As a brass player, I play a lot of Bach transcriptions. Great fun! <P>This reminds me of sister-in-law. She recently attended a recital of the entire WTC. Wow! I wouldn't have lasted to D major! She's a trooper!<P>R
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Re: What exactly characterizes classical music?

Postby SymphonyMan » Thu Dec 26, 2002 12:48 pm

Eugene,<BR> I used to think Bach was really *yawn* uninspirational just due to the enormous amount of pieces he wrote. But! Take it one piece at a time. I am a pianist, organist, violinist, and young conductor as well. Taking a Bach keyboard piece and analyzing it rather than comparing it to all the other preludes and fugues in the Well Tempered Clavier books will bring a lot more appreciation for what Bach composed...ESPECIALLY as a conductor. Also, try playing some of Bach's organ works. Although you may not be an organist, just play the manual parts on the piano and look at how the parts interweave with eachother (Especially my favorite, the "Gigue Fugue" in G Major..I want to say BWV 577). Some of Bach's music doesn't do much for me emotionally, but the musical genious of Bach's works are quite amazing when you really analyze his pieces! Give him another chance from a more "music theory" point of view if he can't spark any emotion! It's genious!
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Re: What exactly characterizes classical music?

Postby bignaf » Thu Dec 26, 2002 3:17 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Rustle:<BR><STRONG>This reminds me of sister-in-law. She recently attended a recital of the entire WTC. Wow! I wouldn't have lasted to D major! She's a trooper!<P>R</STRONG><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>speaking of trupers. reminds me of a story about Arthur Schnabel. after a heavy concert by him (with three or four heavyweight Beethoven sonatas) the audience clamored for a encore. so Schnabel sat down and played the Diabelli variations. by the time he was done there was only one person (besides him) in the hall. :D
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Re: What exactly characterizes classical music?

Postby EJA » Mon Dec 30, 2002 7:43 pm

I've watched this thread for some time now, and, as the official Beethoven Bulletin Board Lightning Rod, hesitate to disturb its comparative placidity. <P>Nevertheless, I would like to posit my own definition of what distinguishes classical music. I think that what distinguishes classical music is that it is composed and performed by <I>professional musicians</I>. Pop music, on the other hand is produced by <I>professional entertainers</I>. Admittedly, this is a generalization; categorization demands generalization. Sure, there are a lot of grey areas. Yes, there are categories of music other than pop and classical. <P>Now, to amplify. It is my observation that the level of dedication and the degree of investment <I>in music</I> by those whom we generally consider to be classical artists far exceeds that of those whom we generally consider to be pop artists. This is not to say that pop artists are not dedicated to their trade, nor is it to say that they do not heavily invest in it. This is only to say that their trade is not solely music. Classical musicians, I find, are generally dedicated almost exclusively to music. Classical performance centers on the music. Popular performances of all kinds seem to be more focused on titilation of the audience. <P>And that's my opinion on that.
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Re: What exactly characterizes classical music?

Postby OperaTenor » Mon Dec 30, 2002 8:35 pm

EJA, I feel that dovetails somewhat with my characterization of what qualifies. As I stated earlier, it seems to me a distinction between artistic and commercial focus. I see a parallel between your distinction and mine (always looking for someone to align with, you know :D ). :p<p>[ 12-30-2002: Message edited by: operatenor ]
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