Is George Bush the right leader for America?

[Shapley]

Nicole:

RE:One thing he said that impressed me is the first thing he will do (within 24 hours of taking office) is put forth legislation for national health care. (If it passes is another story.) But it's more then Bush has done.

As a Senator, he has had ample opportunity to present just such a bill. What magical powers or new knowledge will he, as a newly elected president, have that he lacks now? If he has such a bill written, he should submit it, get some co-sponsors, and get it voted on. If not, then it is just more campaign posturing.

V/R
Shapley

[OperaTenor]

JK's version of National Health Care is not the same as everyone else's, from what I read on his website. It does not guarantee equal access to health care for all Americans. What it seems to do is redirect tax money to pay for health care for the indigent, and to some extent redefine what consitutes indigency. At the same time, it puts into effect what amount to protections for the health insurance industry. There are caps on prescriptions and services for what they can charge insurance companies .

This is not NHC. It is more blow-hard legislation for legislation's sake.

Jim "blow-hard should be hyphenated, shouldn't it?" B.

[haggis]

"JK's version of National Health Care is not the same as everyone else's, from what I read on his website. It does not guarantee equal access to health care for all Americans. What it seems to do is redirect tax money to pay for health care for the indigent, and to some extent redefine what consitutes indigency. At the same time, it puts into effect what amount to protections for the health insurance industry. There are caps on prescriptions and services for what they can charge insurance companies ."

OT, I am really impressed by your research.

(Ed. "I guess a near fatal accident, extended hospital stay and 2+ years fighting with medical insurance companies tends to focus one's attention when politicians make health care claims!")

[OperaTenor]

Thanks.

Unfortunately, even though one wouldn't know it to look at me, I've been a regular user of the health care system from the age of 10, including upwards of 30 full-blown surgical procedures. All too well acquainted with the system. I've seen the system develop from leaving the hospital healed to the current "treat 'em & street 'em" philosophy.

To me, health care policies and agendas are a simple litmus test for a candidate. The way a certain politician deals with all issues is usually evidenced by the way they talk about/around health care. JK obfusicates, GWB courts big business. End of story.

Jim "naive maybe, not dumb, hopefully" B.

<small>[ 09-10-2004, 12:16 PM: Message edited by: OperaTenor ]</small>

[barfle]

I'm not sure why Kerry thinks he will have a better chance of getting a bill through the Senate after November than before it, but so far GWB has not vetoed a single spending bill to reach his desk.

I doubt if he would veto this one, either.

[Nicole Marie]

Wow Haggis... way to take it personal. Big breath and calm down. Bad day?

So to reply you:

"You have been either wrong and out of context in every claim you have ever made." Score one for blanket statements! Hip hip hooray! You claim I make them all the time... seems like you are capable of it too. Let's have a discussion and give some examples please.

"I'm sure there's a cell in Gitmo with your name on it" Real nice. Thanks, I'll send you a postcard.

"You were wrong about the deficit, and didn't admit it." The estimated population of the United States is 294,113,559 so each citizen's share of this debt is $25,088.23. Any way you look at it, the national debt is way out of control. And further more, that last statement I made about the national debt was what FOX NEWS was reporting that day. And no I have not researched it further so I have no reason to know if I'm wrong and if I am wrong who the hell should I apologize to? Bush!? I'll send him a letter. "Dear Mr. Bush, Haggis from the Beethoven.com Bulletin Board would like me to apologize to you for repeating information I heard on Fox News. Please except my apology. Yours truely, HRH"

"You are wrong about education spending and grade standards, and won't admit it" No child left behind is the worst education system ever developed. It's a waste of tax dollars. No Child Left Behind mandates testing of all students and withholds federal funds for schools that do not participate or schools whose scores do not meet minimum levels. Children with special needs test scores are factored into the general population of the school test scores. A special needs child in the eighth grade, for example, may only function on a third grade level. That child’s test scores will factor into the overall score of the school, bringing the score down. A special needs child cannot function on the same level. But yet their test score is not treated individually. That is not fair to that child or the rest of the school. My sister is a special needs teacher. She has seen it first hand. The town I live in, used to be #1 in the state for education and has now fallen to last b/c of the unfair scoring. It's a flawed system and is a waste of tax dollars and only serves to hurt education. http://www.nea.org/esea/

"and you are on the wrong side of history, and don't know it." Score 2 for blanket statements! Why don't have a discussion with me and point out what you are talking about.

"The main difference between us that I can tell is that I don't believe in name calling and personal attacks on candidates while you seem to depend on them to make your point." Yes, you’re right. I'm an idiot (oh and I'm blond too!) So of course I am not capable of any type of meaningful conversation. I must resort to name calling to make my points. So hear goes (clear throat): Haggis you a@@$*%e, son of a *$&%^#, I'm a total fool for thinking I could post an opinion! WOW! I'm a $&%^*#(*.

"I think the candidates are honorable Americans who love America." At least we can agree on that.


"Find one major Republican who has attacked John Kerry personally, and please, 527s are off limits simply because the rebuttals would bury you.

Next frothy mouth claim, please"

"frothy mouth" "bury you"... real nice. Last time I heard that I was in middle school. Want to meet me by the tracks at 3 o'clock? Put 'em up... come on!

My last post in no way targeted you. It was not hostile and not rude. You posted your opinion, I posted mine. To bad we can't have a discussion. Hope your day gets better. Hope you get a laugh out of my replies too. You see, I'm not only capable of name calling (another joke) I'm also capable of being nice. So I hope your day picks up, and you don't see the difference of opinions as a reason to get angry or hope I foam at the mouth and end up in a jail cell.

<small>[ 09-10-2004, 01:38 PM: Message edited by: Nicole Marie ]</small>

[Nicole Marie]

<small>[ 09-10-2004, 01:36 PM: Message edited by: Nicole Marie ]</small>

[RC]

Reminiscence:

I remember my first day of work with the airlines when all the new guys congregated in the "ramp ready room" and waited for the supervisor to come in and welcome us to United.

I believe he used the "F" word five times...in his first sentence. He said, "...and if you're offended by the word #&^$, you can leave right now."

I spent about nine years bouncing around that environment, figured out how to interpret the new language. Its just a different form of communication - a different mind set. Haggis will undoubtedly know what I'm talking about having been in the service a while.

Then I turned around and started working with a bunch of high-brow's and had to wear panty hose and use proper speech and etiquette and I'd nearly forgotten how. But they aren't any different from the airline crowd.

If you aren't REALLY listening, you aren't REALLY learning anything. How sad is that?

[mmichaelson]

Wow. Things in here have gotten UGLY. I think my little Republican-loving self will take a hiatus from this room for a while. . .

[Serenity]

Originally posted by Saxy Buff:
I think my little Republican-loving self will take a hiatus from this room for a while. . .

Wait! Don't go! I was going to ask you what you like about the Republican party....

[mmichaelson]

HA! There are so many things to say. . .

-I'm very pro-life
-I'm not particularly pro-homosexual marriage
-I'm pro-capital punishment, for the most part
-I'm VERY for a strong military
-I'm pro-the right to carry weapons
-I'm for prayer in schools

Not a true republican, but you can see earlier posts for that. I just usually swing closer to their ideas on most issues. . .

Is that enough, or should I go on Serenity?

[OperaTenor]

Serenity, FOMCROTFLMAO!

[mmichaelson]

What was that?? FOMCROTFLMAO???

Huh??

[Shapley]

RC,

RE: I'm very pro-life ...
-I'm pro-capital punishment, for the most part

I take it that means you're pro-innocent-life?

V/R
Shapley

[OperaTenor]

Originally posted by Saxy Buff:

-I'm very pro-life
...
-I'm pro-capital punishment, for the most part

To me, those stances have always seemed a bit contradictory, morally speaking.

[mmichaelson]

sort of, yes. But the circumstances are different. I'm not totally pro-capital punishment (the death penalty), but just in some really extreme cases. But I find myself questioning this as I get older, especially when we start to question how the injection "feels" and if it is humane or not.
This one subject is shakey for me, but I am very adament about my pro-life stance. . .

[OperaTenor]

Originally posted by Saxy Buff:
What was that?? FOMCROTFLMAO???

Huh??

If you ask Shap, it's FOAMCROTCHFLAMEO, but what it really means is:

Fell Off My Chair Rolling On The Floor Laughing My A$$ Off

<small>[ 09-10-2004, 05:18 PM: Message edited by: OperaTenor ]</small>

[OperaTenor]

Hi Saxy,

Yes, I remember, you're one of the extreme minority who would be willing to adopt an unwanted child unconditionally.

[mmichaelson]

That is me! I think every child deserves a chance at life and a home. . .
and am willing to follow that up if needs be!

[rwcrooks]

Saxy,

If you lived in Wisconsin, I'd run my 12-year old over to you in a second on some days!